661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote 1st. Honduras is the murder capital.
2nd. The US provides guns to the Mexican cartels using the gun show loophole. Not the other way around.
3rd. Guns bought from said loophole are not registered. Thus, untraceable.

The reason why gun crime rate is high is because of the "war on drugs". Legalize and regulate. If you want to stop mass/school shootings, universal background checks.

1. Brazil has the most gun related deaths in the world.
2. If you believe that crap then you should study up. And the Mexican cartels aren't the only ones.
3. I already said that. This loophole stuff does not supply the whole Mexican cartel, maybe a good 4%

A cartel leader saying he buys all of his guns in U.S.

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PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

Finder wrote

PowerButton wrote

Finder wrote

tpayne174 wrote Ok, whether we are talking about automatics or semi autos, if a criminal wants a gun, he/she will get a gun. Illegally or legally. Price is no matter for some of these people.

That is true to an extent. Making laws that regulate who owns guns and what type of guns can be owned legally will make it a lot harder for criminals to get weapons. I don't think anyone will ever be in a predicament in which they would be better of having a semi-automatic rifle than a pistol.

A pistol is perfectly capable of protecting you. I'm not saying weapons should be banned by no means. I do think laws need to be made that makes it harder for people to get a weapon.

Every law that bans a gun, or makes it harder to get one will only make these criminal organizations more powerful.

How in the world would making something illegal make organizations more powerful?

That's like saying if alcohol were to be made illegal it would make companies like Budweiser more powerful.

Alcohol is a perfect example. If you know your history well you should know about the time US prohibited alcohol. A ring leader named Al Kapone took advantage of this time and had billions of dollars worth alcohol smuggled and sold. Because of this Al Kapone's Gang was one of the most deadliest in their time.

The situation now is gangs or criminal organizations will no doubt take advantage of this situation. Re-read what I wrote on the very start.

Alcohol and guns are two different things. People can be addicted to Alcohol, Alcoholism. Its consumable. Guns are not.

C
Ban of Assault Rifles=No assault Rifles + A person who wants an assault rifle + A gang selling them = Money for the gang and Another weapon out there.

Gangs do not make their own assault rifles. So if there would be a ban, they would need to get it from the Mexican cartels. Currently, the Mexican cartels are in war with each other. Why would they sell something they need? Cartels make most of their money from drug sells. Not gun sells, because they don't sell guns they buy them. As for assault rifles already in the U.S., the government would do a buy back. Meaning, gang members can go and sell their guns to the government. No questions asked.

Some of these statements I have already said. And believe it or not some do make their own. Cartels do a bit of both of supplying and using. Please research before you post this information. If your saying a gang or a cartel wouldn't put guns on the underground market your just plain ignorant.

Can you show me any proof that gangs make their own assault rifles? If you would to read carefully, you would see that im not saying they wont put them on the underground market. Im saying, currently guns flow from U.S. to cartels. If you cut off that supply, the only places the cartels would get them is from central America. Therefore, gangs here in the U.S. will have a more difficult time getting them, since you have to have a connection to either a cartel or directly from central America. Every time that gun is bought and sold someone needs to make a profit. By the time it gets to the U.S. gangs, the cost would be so high, most small gangs wont buy it.

Ever heard of a gunsmith? You act like it's extremely difficult to create a weapon. For some it may be. But when you have the right materials its not. Now you saying guns come from the US because of one news article you have seen is true but only supplies an estimated 2-4% that about 6000 to 10000 guns. Everything else is is smuggled from other countries. When you ban assault rifles there is going to be a higher demand for them in the underground market. Guaranteed.

Guns don't kill people, People kill people .. I hear this alot when it comes to the defence of the gun and yes in a sense it is true but at the same time the gun is a tool that was designed to do one thing "KILL" .

Now before another flame war begins i would like to say that i for one have quite alot of respect for Americans (lol ok for most of them) and on the whole i find alot of them to be free thinking individuals who are able to take as much criticism as they give, Please don't prove me wrong !.

You have to admit something needs to change, If you (America) stay as you are not only will you continue loose alot of young people in horrible ways but you will also create a reputation of being hypercritical and self indulgent.
So what is the awnser ??.
Do you really want to live in a country where it's not safe enough to go to school without a gun for protection ?.
Would you all really be happier if every time you walked into places like schools you had to be searched for weapons ?.
Maybe they could force all school children to wear a uniform which would include a bullet proof vest.
Wow ,Is this really the land of the free that im talking about here or is it now the land of fear ?.

The second amendment has been in use since 1791 and for the time it was written it made good sense BUT times have changed alot and your amendments like it or not are now out dated and needs to be re written for the modern age.
Instead of bickering with eachother why not step up to the plate and be open and honest with eachother ,Change may not be popular but it is inevitable so what sensible concessions would you be willing to take when it comes to the gun and how do you think that would help ?.
It would be good to see you (Americans) being constructive rather than you lot just sticking to your guns (lol .. sorry couldn't resist).

I agree guns should not be banned, if you are going to ban guns then you might as well ban cars, banning guns is not the solution, I think we should have better background checks so that people with mental issues cannot purchase firearms. Also I'm pretty sure banning guns would cause another revolt, look what happened when they banned alcohol in the 1900s, people ran alcohol illegally the same will happen if they ban guns but it will be 100 times worse, just think about the people who will kill to keep their guns, the death count would be bad and a second civil war would likely start splitting up America.

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote 1st. Honduras is the murder capital.
2nd. The US provides guns to the Mexican cartels using the gun show loophole. Not the other way around.
3rd. Guns bought from said loophole are not registered. Thus, untraceable.

The reason why gun crime rate is high is because of the "war on drugs". Legalize and regulate. If you want to stop mass/school shootings, universal background checks.

1. Brazil has the most gun related deaths in the world.
2. If you believe that crap then you should study up. And the Mexican cartels aren't the only ones.
3. I already said that. This loophole stuff does not supply the whole Mexican cartel, maybe a good 4%

A cartel leader saying he buys all of his guns in U.S.

[ Register or Signin to view external links. ]

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

Finder wrote

PowerButton wrote

Finder wrote

tpayne174 wrote Ok, whether we are talking about automatics or semi autos, if a criminal wants a gun, he/she will get a gun. Illegally or legally. Price is no matter for some of these people.

That is true to an extent. Making laws that regulate who owns guns and what type of guns can be owned legally will make it a lot harder for criminals to get weapons. I don't think anyone will ever be in a predicament in which they would be better of having a semi-automatic rifle than a pistol.

A pistol is perfectly capable of protecting you. I'm not saying weapons should be banned by no means. I do think laws need to be made that makes it harder for people to get a weapon.

Every law that bans a gun, or makes it harder to get one will only make these criminal organizations more powerful.

How in the world would making something illegal make organizations more powerful?

That's like saying if alcohol were to be made illegal it would make companies like Budweiser more powerful.

Alcohol is a perfect example. If you know your history well you should know about the time US prohibited alcohol. A ring leader named Al Kapone took advantage of this time and had billions of dollars worth alcohol smuggled and sold. Because of this Al Kapone's Gang was one of the most deadliest in their time.

The situation now is gangs or criminal organizations will no doubt take advantage of this situation. Re-read what I wrote on the very start.

Alcohol and guns are two different things. People can be addicted to Alcohol, Alcoholism. Its consumable. Guns are not.

C
Ban of Assault Rifles=No assault Rifles + A person who wants an assault rifle + A gang selling them = Money for the gang and Another weapon out there.

Gangs do not make their own assault rifles. So if there would be a ban, they would need to get it from the Mexican cartels. Currently, the Mexican cartels are in war with each other. Why would they sell something they need? Cartels make most of their money from drug sells. Not gun sells, because they don't sell guns they buy them. As for assault rifles already in the U.S., the government would do a buy back. Meaning, gang members can go and sell their guns to the government. No questions asked.

Some of these statements I have already said. And believe it or not some do make their own. Cartels do a bit of both of supplying and using. Please research before you post this information. If your saying a gang or a cartel wouldn't put guns on the underground market your just plain ignorant.

Can you show me any proof that gangs make their own assault rifles? If you would to read carefully, you would see that im not saying they wont put them on the underground market. Im saying, currently guns flow from U.S. to cartels. If you cut off that supply, the only places the cartels would get them is from central America. Therefore, gangs here in the U.S. will have a more difficult time getting them, since you have to have a connection to either a cartel or directly from central America. Every time that gun is bought and sold someone needs to make a profit. By the time it gets to the U.S. gangs, the cost would be so high, most small gangs wont buy it.

Ever heard of a gunsmith? You act like it's extremely difficult to create a weapon. For some it may be. But when you have the right materials its not. Now you saying guns come from the US because of one news article you have seen is true but only supplies an estimated 2-4% that about 6000 to 10000 guns. Everything else is is smuggled from other countries. When you ban assault rifles there is going to be a higher demand for them in the underground market. Guaranteed.

Really, how practical is a gunsmith to a corporation in pumping out weapons? Not very much now is it. Can you provide a link to you claims? "When you ban assault rifles there is going to be a higher demand for them in the underground market." Exactly, what happens when there is a high demand for a product that people deem necessary and a short supply for said product? The price goes up. The Juarez cartel was offering US$5000 for ANY AR-15/AK-47 style rifles. Now imagine how much the price would go up if the rifles were banned in the US. Do you really think your local gang can even afford a price increase?

I'm getting sick of these topics.
Most of you on here don't even own a gun and have never used one.

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote 1st. Honduras is the murder capital.
2nd. The US provides guns to the Mexican cartels using the gun show loophole. Not the other way around.
3rd. Guns bought from said loophole are not registered. Thus, untraceable.

The reason why gun crime rate is high is because of the "war on drugs". Legalize and regulate. If you want to stop mass/school shootings, universal background checks.

1. Brazil has the most gun related deaths in the world.
2. If you believe that crap then you should study up. And the Mexican cartels aren't the only ones.
3. I already said that. This loophole stuff does not supply the whole Mexican cartel, maybe a good 4%

A cartel leader saying he buys all of his guns in U.S.

[ Register or Signin to view external links. ]

PowerButton wrote

661King wrote

PowerButton wrote

Finder wrote

PowerButton wrote

Finder wrote

tpayne174 wrote Ok, whether we are talking about automatics or semi autos, if a criminal wants a gun, he/she will get a gun. Illegally or legally. Price is no matter for some of these people.

That is true to an extent. Making laws that regulate who owns guns and what type of guns can be owned legally will make it a lot harder for criminals to get weapons. I don't think anyone will ever be in a predicament in which they would be better of having a semi-automatic rifle than a pistol.

A pistol is perfectly capable of protecting you. I'm not saying weapons should be banned by no means. I do think laws need to be made that makes it harder for people to get a weapon.

Every law that bans a gun, or makes it harder to get one will only make these criminal organizations more powerful.

How in the world would making something illegal make organizations more powerful?

That's like saying if alcohol were to be made illegal it would make companies like Budweiser more powerful.

Alcohol is a perfect example. If you know your history well you should know about the time US prohibited alcohol. A ring leader named Al Kapone took advantage of this time and had billions of dollars worth alcohol smuggled and sold. Because of this Al Kapone's Gang was one of the most deadliest in their time.

The situation now is gangs or criminal organizations will no doubt take advantage of this situation. Re-read what I wrote on the very start.

Alcohol and guns are two different things. People can be addicted to Alcohol, Alcoholism. Its consumable. Guns are not.

C
Ban of Assault Rifles=No assault Rifles + A person who wants an assault rifle + A gang selling them = Money for the gang and Another weapon out there.

Gangs do not make their own assault rifles. So if there would be a ban, they would need to get it from the Mexican cartels. Currently, the Mexican cartels are in war with each other. Why would they sell something they need? Cartels make most of their money from drug sells. Not gun sells, because they don't sell guns they buy them. As for assault rifles already in the U.S., the government would do a buy back. Meaning, gang members can go and sell their guns to the government. No questions asked.

Some of these statements I have already said. And believe it or not some do make their own. Cartels do a bit of both of supplying and using. Please research before you post this information. If your saying a gang or a cartel wouldn't put guns on the underground market your just plain ignorant.

Can you show me any proof that gangs make their own assault rifles? If you would to read carefully, you would see that im not saying they wont put them on the underground market. Im saying, currently guns flow from U.S. to cartels. If you cut off that supply, the only places the cartels would get them is from central America. Therefore, gangs here in the U.S. will have a more difficult time getting them, since you have to have a connection to either a cartel or directly from central America. Every time that gun is bought and sold someone needs to make a profit. By the time it gets to the U.S. gangs, the cost would be so high, most small gangs wont buy it.

Ever heard of a gunsmith? You act like it's extremely difficult to create a weapon. For some it may be. But when you have the right materials its not. Now you saying guns come from the US because of one news article you have seen is true but only supplies an estimated 2-4% that about 6000 to 10000 guns. Everything else is is smuggled from other countries. When you ban assault rifles there is going to be a higher demand for them in the underground market. Guaranteed.

Really, how practical is a gunsmith to a corporation in pumping out weapons? Not very much now is it. Can you provide a link to you claims? "When you ban assault rifles there is going to be a higher demand for them in the underground market." Exactly, what happens when there is a high demand for a product that people deem necessary and a short supply for said product? The price goes up. The Juarez cartel was offering US$5000 for ANY AR-15/AK-47 style rifles. Now imagine how much the price would go up if the rifles were banned in the US. Do you really think your local gang can even afford a price increase?

Actually yes these gangs will do anything for a gun and power.

Reticuli wrote I'm getting sick of these topics.
Most of you on here don't even own a gun and have never used one.

If you don't like it then please got to another topic that you might have interest in. I myself do own quite a few guns and enjoy it as a hobby.

sip666 wrote It wont even be banned because it is under the 2nd amendment that people have the right to bear arms and if Obama wants to ban that he need the majority vote from the citizens and i know that almost every still wants guns.

Its the people who sells the guns are the retards they need to do back ground checks to see if they have a metal disability of not.

Banning Guns in general is stupid because its not going to happen they need to control who they sell it to and not the type of weapon they sell.

Right now i own a M4 and a M9 and if they banned assualt rifles then what are they going to do go around to every house in America and taking all of our guns.

It does not matter if it's the second amendment. Congress, the senate, president and the house of representatives can come together and eliminate the amendment not the people. Guns don't kill people we do and like most of the other members said here will be and always will be a way to get a gun.

PowerButton wrote Banning guns is not the solution to decrease gun violence in the US.

Banning guns of any type, will only create more of them. Cartels and Gangs will simply smuggle these in and make more money than they ever have before. Not only will the guns be un-traceable, but now Gangs and Cartels are more powerful and the US will be spending more money on the "Drug War". Let's use Brazil as an example, Brazil has fully banned guns and they now have the most gun related deaths in the entire world. Thanks to all the criminals bringing in these guns, brazil is the murder capitol. Switzerland on the other hand requires it's citizens to have guns, they have the lowest crime rate in the world.

That's my opinion.

What's yours?

Alright, here's my opinion, backed up with actual facts. My opinion is that assault rifles should be banned, and every other type of gun should require a background check.

Now, you say Brazil is the "murder capital of the world". Any facts to back this up? Second of all, Brazil is a developing country that is completely different to the US. Notice how you didn't compare the US to Canada, the UK, Australia, Japan, or other developed countries that are actually similar to the US.

Why do you need guns? The thing is, you'd actually have less crime if guns were banned, so there's no need for "protection". As for hunting, you could get a hunting license.

You go on and on about these theories of what could happen if guns are removed. Let's look at other countries that are ACTUALLY SIMILAR to the US in culture, quality of life, etc. The following is a list of countries by firearm related death rates per 100,000 people.

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US= 10.2
Switzerland= 3.4
France= 3.00
New Zealand= 2.66
Canada= 2.13
Germany= 1.10
Australia= 1.05
United Kingdom= 0.25
Japan=0.07

Notice how the US has the most firearm related death rate among all developed countries. Japan has one of the most strict gun control laws in the word, and their firearm related death rate is approximately 145 times less than the US's. Even Canada, the country the US borders, has a firearm related death rate that is over 4 times less than the US's, simply by introducing more gun control. Switzerland has the lowest crime rate in the world? That's BS, and you know it. Even if Switzerland's crime rate is low, they're the outlier, and that's usually not what happens when you give your citizens guns. Besides, Switzerland doesn't have the lowest crime rate in the world. Even then, the US has two times more guns per capita than the Switzerland, and it still has multiple times more crime than them. Obviously, what's working for Switzerland doesn't work for the US, but what works for Canada, the UK, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, and virutally every other developed country will.

I know I'll face a lot of dislikes from ignorant Americans who will refuse to even read the rest of my post once I stated my opinion in the beginning of it, but I don't care, just wanted to share my thoughts, again, backed up by facts.

Establish wrote

PowerButton wrote Banning guns is not the solution to decrease gun violence in the US.

Banning guns of any type, will only create more of them. Cartels and Gangs will simply smuggle these in and make more money than they ever have before. Not only will the guns be un-traceable, but now Gangs and Cartels are more powerful and the US will be spending more money on the "Drug War". Let's use Brazil as an example, Brazil has fully banned guns and they now have the most gun related deaths in the entire world. Thanks to all the criminals bringing in these guns, brazil is the murder capitol. Switzerland on the other hand requires it's citizens to have guns, they have the lowest crime rate in the world.

That's my opinion.

What's yours?

Alright, here's my opinion, backed up with actual facts. My opinion is that assault rifles should be banned, and every other type of gun should require a background check.

Now, you say Brazil is the "murder capital of the world". Any facts to back this up? Second of all, Brazil is a developing country that is completely different to the US. Notice how you didn't compare the US to Canada, the UK, Australia, Japan, or other developed countries that are actually similar to the US.

Why do you need guns? The thing is, you'd actually have less crime if guns were banned, so there's no need for "protection". As for hunting, you could get a hunting license.

You go on and on about these theories of what could happen if guns are removed. Let's look at other countries that are ACTUALLY SIMILAR to the US in culture, quality of life, etc. The following is a list of countries by firearm related death rates per 100,000 people.

[ Register or Signin to view external links. ]

US= 10.2
Switzerland= 3.4
France= 3.00
New Zealand= 2.66
Canada= 2.13
Germany= 1.10
Australia= 1.05
United Kingdom= 0.25
Japan=0.07

Notice how the US has the most firearm related death rate among all developed countries. Japan has one of the most strict gun control laws in the word, and their firearm related death rate is approximately 145 times less than the US's. Even Canada, the country the US borders, has a firearm related death rate that is over 4 times less than the US's, simply by introducing more gun control. Switzerland has the lowest crime rate in the world? That's BS, and you know it. Even if Switzerland's crime rate is low, they're the outlier, and that's usually not what happens when you give your citizens guns. Besides, Switzerland doesn't have the lowest crime rate in the world. Even then, the US has two times more guns per capita than the Switzerland, and it still has multiple times more crime than them. Obviously, what's working for Switzerland doesn't work for the US, but what works for Canada, the UK, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, and virutally every other developed country will.

I know I'll face a lot of dislikes from ignorant Americans who will refuse to even read the rest of my post once I stated my opinion in the beginning of it, but I don't care, just wanted to share my thoughts, again, backed up by facts.

My friend your facts mean nothing. Especially if you don't even live in the US and haven't kept up with political events within the United States. The United States citizens are used to having such weaponry. So you are completely wrong saying that the methods used by Japan, Canada, and the other countries you have listed will work for the United States. Just because you place a law like this doesn't mean everything is magically going to stop.