M9z wrote Another option in reply to the one above me is to remove the GPU entirely, and go for an APU, it's basically a CPU/GPU combo that acts as any other CPU would, fits in the same socket and everything, and Ryzen definitely had a few good ones that are budget friendly for the AM4 Socket type

Dashii wrote

M9z wrote Another option in reply to the one above me is to remove the GPU entirely, and go for an APU, it's basically a CPU/GPU combo that acts as any other CPU would, fits in the same socket and everything, and Ryzen definitely had a few good ones that are budget friendly for the AM4 Socket type

Do you have a suggestion as to which? Thanks!

M9z wrote the Ryzen 3 1200... not gonna be 4k ultimate but it's capable of running smoothly.

M9z wrote They run hot, but they're designed to, recently upgraded to a 5700 xt, also runs hot, but from AMD that's not that much of a worry as it's intended to red line, and keep on going lol

21 wrote

M9z wrote the Ryzen 3 1200... not gonna be 4k ultimate but it's capable of running smoothly.

This is not accurate. Demand lessens on the CPU as resolution increases, so 4k is easier on CPU than 1080p. You wouldn't really see/want an R3 1200 in a system paired with a 4k monitor, but it is perfectly capable for 4k, and is technically better for 4k than it is for 1080p. Hence why for 1080p240Hz, it's beneficial to have something like an i9-9900k.

M9z wrote They run hot, but they're designed to, recently upgraded to a 5700 xt, also runs hot, but from AMD that's not that much of a worry as it's intended to red line, and keep on going lol

This also is not accurate. AMD GPU's are not "intended to red line" at all. Polaris(RX 480/580) and Navi(5700/XT) are actually pretty efficient architectures. Not quite as efficient as NVidia, but far better than pre-Maxwell NVidia and the likes of Vega.

There are 2 reasons people think AMD "run hot";
1- shitty reference coolers. I think everyone at this point knows that AMD's reference coolers(other than Radeon 7) are absolutely terrible. They're not doing themselves any favours by cheaping out and sticking to the blower style, but they know partners are gonna produce far better coolers anyway. Get an AIB AMD card and you shouldn't have much issue.

2- Sometimes, like with Vega, AMD crank the voltage right up. The reason they do this, is so that they can maximise the amount of silicon that will hit their rated base/boost clock speeds. More usable silicon = more money since they have more GPUs to sell. What this means, is that a pretty large percentage of cards are running at far higher voltage than necessary. This is why, especially with Vega, you see a lot of people actually raising clock speed(overclocking) AND lowering voltage(reducing temps).

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OP;
I wouldn't bother dropping the RX 580. An APU isn't gonna be fun if you plan on doing any gaming really. You also aren't going to save much money by dropping the GPU and switching the R3 1200 for an APU, maybe 50-100 quid saved but the RX 580 will be a vastly better gaming experience. If you wanted the APU just to have integrated graphics, or to get the system up and running before you add a GPU, then I'd just get the R3 2200G. If it was me though, and I was spending more on the CPU, I'd go for more cores rather than integrated graphics, so an R5 1600/2600(like I already stated above).

M9z wrote As for the first statement you quoted, you're right, but also wrong in a way. I know demand on a CPU lessens when you push higher resolutions depending on your GPU, but I was talking about an APU alone, so when I said it's not going to run 4k ultimate, I was correct, no APU that I currently know of could run a game in ultimate detail in 4k.

M9z wrote I've always known AMD CPU's and GPU's to run hotter in similar scenarios against Intel and Nvidia

M9z wrote and hit a higher top heat as compared to Nvidia before they thermal throttle

21 wrote

M9z wrote As for the first statement you quoted, you're right, but also wrong in a way. I know demand on a CPU lessens when you push higher resolutions depending on your GPU, but I was talking about an APU alone, so when I said it's not going to run 4k ultimate, I was correct, no APU that I currently know of could run a game in ultimate detail in 4k.

"the CPU he recommended is the Ryzen 3 1200 which retails for about $60 as it is a bit of an older model, don't let that fool you though as it's still perfectly capable for some decent gaming, not gonna be 4k ultimate but it's capable of running smoothly."

The CPU he recommends is an R3 1200, that is not capable of "4k ultimate" is what you said. So no, I'm not "right, but also wrong".

M9z wrote I've always known AMD CPU's and GPU's to run hotter in similar scenarios against Intel and Nvidia

Depends entirely which 2 CPU's or GPU's you're comparing. Intel, NVidia, and AMD all have lots of different architectures they've used. Look at Bulldozer vs Ryzen. Ryzen is more efficient than Intel's current architecture, so it definitely doesn't run hotter than Intel.

As for the GPU side, the RX 580 was a GTX 1060 competitor and assuming coolers were the same/similar, temps between the 2 GPU's shouldn't be vastly different. Like I said, yes, NVidia are still more efficient on the GPU side but AMD aren't anywhere near as bad as they have been in the past- nor as bad as NVidia ave been pre-Maxwell.

This obviously isn't your fault you think that, it's a common statement when people are talking about PC hardware, "Oh, AMD runs hot and loud", but it just isn't accurate. It used to be in some cases, but nowadays, not so much. Other than the likes of Vega, which as I said was overvolted from factory to maximise usable silicon.

M9z wrote and hit a higher top heat as compared to Nvidia before they thermal throttle

I'm actually not 100% sure about this. AMD and NVidia both report different temps from different parts of the GPU now though, IIRC. So 80c on an NVidia GPU isn't the same as 80c on an AMD GPU. AMD displays the junction temp, which is technically more useful for making sure you don't throttle.

For thermal throttling, I think Turing is still the 85c range? I'm pretty sure around 85c has been NVidia's temp for a few generations now at which thermal throttling will start.
Navi I actually am not sure when it'll start to thermal throttle, but I think between 95-105c?
NVidia probably mention what their thermal throttle range is, at least they used to I believe. For Navi GPUs specifically, I'm almost certain GamersNexus has a video on when they'' start to thermal throttle and what temps are acceptable- I've not watched it though, hence why I'm not certain.