killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote I would much rather be in reality rather than being in a coma with my family using their free time to sit next to my side as I do nothing, but sit there. Maybe my mind is still active, there has probably been research if the mind is still working to a point where I am having a lucid dream type of thing. If it is like that I still would rather be in reality.

And what if your family and friends were to all participate in the same thing as you?

Are you saying like all my friends and family are somehow all connected with me and each where their brains are actually controlling their lucid self people? So like we could all control our own little worlds but still be able to see each other. It would be very tempting, but I would only want to do it for about a period of like three weeks, it would be much longer to those in the dream though. I would want to get out and continue with my life go to college, and get a job as a scientist.

Not quite. I'm saying that instead of them thinking for themselves, your brain thinks for them, so therefore no conflict. The same would go for each of them and in your dream, you would probably become closer to them.

No I would not want it that way, I would not get to know them better it would be my mind's recreation of them.

What if you were in the state permanently?

If I was in the state permanently than I would totally recreate people's personalities. I would make myself have this huge awesome house, and everyone would love me, but after so long I would notice the "edges" fading I would slowly lose any kind of reach for reality until I died.

That's the beauty; if you're dreaming, you won't remember all of what happened so you won't notice them fading. You would be "living in the moment".

It wouldn't be beauty, I am the kind of person who knows when I'm dreaming and when I'm not. I am also able to remember my dreams.

But do you remember a dream in a dream?

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote I would much rather be in reality rather than being in a coma with my family using their free time to sit next to my side as I do nothing, but sit there. Maybe my mind is still active, there has probably been research if the mind is still working to a point where I am having a lucid dream type of thing. If it is like that I still would rather be in reality.

And what if your family and friends were to all participate in the same thing as you?

Are you saying like all my friends and family are somehow all connected with me and each where their brains are actually controlling their lucid self people? So like we could all control our own little worlds but still be able to see each other. It would be very tempting, but I would only want to do it for about a period of like three weeks, it would be much longer to those in the dream though. I would want to get out and continue with my life go to college, and get a job as a scientist.

Not quite. I'm saying that instead of them thinking for themselves, your brain thinks for them, so therefore no conflict. The same would go for each of them and in your dream, you would probably become closer to them.

No I would not want it that way, I would not get to know them better it would be my mind's recreation of them.

What if you were in the state permanently?

If I was in the state permanently than I would totally recreate people's personalities. I would make myself have this huge awesome house, and everyone would love me, but after so long I would notice the "edges" fading I would slowly lose any kind of reach for reality until I died.

That's the beauty; if you're dreaming, you won't remember all of what happened so you won't notice them fading. You would be "living in the moment".

It wouldn't be beauty, I am the kind of person who knows when I'm dreaming and when I'm not. I am also able to remember my dreams.

But do you remember a dream in a dream?

are you illuminati? haha

Very good post next time put it in a spoil haha

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote I would much rather be in reality rather than being in a coma with my family using their free time to sit next to my side as I do nothing, but sit there. Maybe my mind is still active, there has probably been research if the mind is still working to a point where I am having a lucid dream type of thing. If it is like that I still would rather be in reality.

And what if your family and friends were to all participate in the same thing as you?

Are you saying like all my friends and family are somehow all connected with me and each where their brains are actually controlling their lucid self people? So like we could all control our own little worlds but still be able to see each other. It would be very tempting, but I would only want to do it for about a period of like three weeks, it would be much longer to those in the dream though. I would want to get out and continue with my life go to college, and get a job as a scientist.

Not quite. I'm saying that instead of them thinking for themselves, your brain thinks for them, so therefore no conflict. The same would go for each of them and in your dream, you would probably become closer to them.

No I would not want it that way, I would not get to know them better it would be my mind's recreation of them.

What if you were in the state permanently?

If I was in the state permanently than I would totally recreate people's personalities. I would make myself have this huge awesome house, and everyone would love me, but after so long I would notice the "edges" fading I would slowly lose any kind of reach for reality until I died.

That's the beauty; if you're dreaming, you won't remember all of what happened so you won't notice them fading. You would be "living in the moment".

It wouldn't be beauty, I am the kind of person who knows when I'm dreaming and when I'm not. I am also able to remember my dreams.

But do you remember a dream in a dream?

You can not actually dream in a dream, when you "fall" asleep in a dream it does not mean you are in another dream. You are just normal dreaming. So if we are considering a dream within a dream, a dream, then yes I do.

What I mean is, maybe you remember some, but you can't know that you remember all your dreams.

morgsboi wrote

Click to View Content

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote I would much rather be in reality rather than being in a coma with my family using their free time to sit next to my side as I do nothing, but sit there. Maybe my mind is still active, there has probably been research if the mind is still working to a point where I am having a lucid dream type of thing. If it is like that I still would rather be in reality.

And what if your family and friends were to all participate in the same thing as you?

Are you saying like all my friends and family are somehow all connected with me and each where their brains are actually controlling their lucid self people? So like we could all control our own little worlds but still be able to see each other. It would be very tempting, but I would only want to do it for about a period of like three weeks, it would be much longer to those in the dream though. I would want to get out and continue with my life go to college, and get a job as a scientist.

Not quite. I'm saying that instead of them thinking for themselves, your brain thinks for them, so therefore no conflict. The same would go for each of them and in your dream, you would probably become closer to them.

No I would not want it that way, I would not get to know them better it would be my mind's recreation of them.

What if you were in the state permanently?

If I was in the state permanently than I would totally recreate people's personalities. I would make myself have this huge awesome house, and everyone would love me, but after so long I would notice the "edges" fading I would slowly lose any kind of reach for reality until I died.

That's the beauty; if you're dreaming, you won't remember all of what happened so you won't notice them fading. You would be "living in the moment".

It wouldn't be beauty, I am the kind of person who knows when I'm dreaming and when I'm not. I am also able to remember my dreams.

But do you remember a dream in a dream?

You can not actually dream in a dream, when you "fall" asleep in a dream it does not mean you are in another dream. You are just normal dreaming. So if we are considering a dream within a dream, a dream, then yes I do.

What I mean is, maybe you remember some, but you can't know that you remember all your dreams.

That is true. I can not know if there are dreams that I do not remember. I can't remember I forgot a dream if I can't remember the dream in the first place. Well I guess there are times when I wake immediately from a dream only to forget I had it other than that distinct memory of I dream. Bravo I applaud for catching my small lie. I do not remember all of my dreams. Just a great percentage of them.

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

Click to View Content

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote

morgsboi wrote

killofduty wrote I would much rather be in reality rather than being in a coma with my family using their free time to sit next to my side as I do nothing, but sit there. Maybe my mind is still active, there has probably been research if the mind is still working to a point where I am having a lucid dream type of thing. If it is like that I still would rather be in reality.

And what if your family and friends were to all participate in the same thing as you?

Are you saying like all my friends and family are somehow all connected with me and each where their brains are actually controlling their lucid self people? So like we could all control our own little worlds but still be able to see each other. It would be very tempting, but I would only want to do it for about a period of like three weeks, it would be much longer to those in the dream though. I would want to get out and continue with my life go to college, and get a job as a scientist.

Not quite. I'm saying that instead of them thinking for themselves, your brain thinks for them, so therefore no conflict. The same would go for each of them and in your dream, you would probably become closer to them.

No I would not want it that way, I would not get to know them better it would be my mind's recreation of them.

What if you were in the state permanently?

If I was in the state permanently than I would totally recreate people's personalities. I would make myself have this huge awesome house, and everyone would love me, but after so long I would notice the "edges" fading I would slowly lose any kind of reach for reality until I died.

That's the beauty; if you're dreaming, you won't remember all of what happened so you won't notice them fading. You would be "living in the moment".

It wouldn't be beauty, I am the kind of person who knows when I'm dreaming and when I'm not. I am also able to remember my dreams.

But do you remember a dream in a dream?

You can not actually dream in a dream, when you "fall" asleep in a dream it does not mean you are in another dream. You are just normal dreaming. So if we are considering a dream within a dream, a dream, then yes I do.

What I mean is, maybe you remember some, but you can't know that you remember all your dreams.

That is true. I can not know if there are dreams that I do not remember. I can't remember I forgot a dream if I can't remember the dream in the first place. Well I guess there are times when I wake immediately from a dream only to forget I had it other than that distinct memory of I dream. Bravo I applaud for catching my small lie. I do not remember all of my dreams. Just a great percentage of them.

The same with me. I usually remember my dreams when I wake up in the middle of one and can't go back to sleep. Sometimes, I wake up and it takes me a minute to know if what's happened in my dream had actually happened.

Morgsboi, you may be interested to know, assuming you don't already, the views of Socrates and Descartes on the subject of Dreams.

This goes off topic slightly from your original question, but considering my last post on this topic already went off on a tangent, I don't see any harm in doing it again.

Socrates believed in something called a 'Daemonion', which was essentially a divine inner voice which could only be accessed or heard within the dream state.
Thomas Aquinas later backed this up, but instead of simply a divine inner voice, he stated that it was the voice of God, but that we should not listen to it, as it may be the voice of a demon, attempting to trick you into sin.
Moving back to Socrates and i'm going to claw at scraps right now trying to fit this with the topic, perhaps the voice, which has, after centuries of scrutiny been reverted back down to human intuition is the only thing that stops the dream state from becoming our reality?

Moving swiftly onto Rene Descartes, author of the famous philosophical phrase, 'I think therefore I am', disagreed with Socrates and instead stated that empirically, it is impossible to differentiate between the dream state and reality.

This fits nicely with the theory that we could all be in a coma right now.
Without the voice or intuition guiding us, we would be aware and unaware at the same time if Descartes is correct.

I apologize if this is a little hard to understand, but you are intelligent and educated on the subject, so I doubt you will have any trouble.

Edit:

Why stop at 2?

German Philosopher 'Kant' suggested that there are two types of worlds, Noumenal world, how things actually were independent of our perceptions of them [dreams] and the Phenomenal world, how we perceive the world around us.
However, Kant also stated that there was no way to travel between the two.
But, there was an American Philosopher called William James, he was also a psychologist and he moved Kant's theory up a level, stating that when we were in a dream state it was reality because that's where our thoughts were.
This is an extension of the theory that nothing exists until you perceive it. His reasoning was that if you cannot perceive anything real while you are dreaming, then where are you?
You can't be nowhere, otherwise you would die, so he stated that a dream was the bodies way of providing somewhere to exist for the duration of time you are asleep.
What if, the first time you fall asleep, the body is unable to begin perceiving the phenomenal world again so you are stuck in the false reality that your mind has created for you.

Kant also suggested that if one were able to travel between the two worlds, that person would be gifted or given prophetic visions because the Phenomenal world would run parallel to, but not equal with the Noumenal world.
Perhaps Nostradamus and other prophets had the ability to switch back and forth between these worlds?

Wez wrote Morgsboi, you may be interested to know, assuming you don't already, the views of Socrates and Descartes on the subject of Dreams.

This goes off topic slightly from your original question, but considering my last post on this topic already went off on a tangent, I don't see any harm in doing it again.

Socrates believed in something called a 'Daemonion', which was essentially a divine inner voice which could only be accessed or heard within the dream state.
Thomas Aquinas later backed this up, but instead of simply a divine inner voice, he stated that it was the voice of God, but that we should not listen to it, as it may be the voice of a demon, attempting to trick you into sin.
Moving back to Socrates and i'm going to claw at scraps right now trying to fit this with the topic, perhaps the voice, which has, after centuries of scrutiny been reverted back down to human intuition is the only thing that stops the dream state from becoming our reality?

Moving swiftly onto Rene Descartes, author of the famous philosophical phrase, 'I think therefore I am', disagreed with Socrates and instead stated that empirically, it is impossible to differentiate between the dream state and reality.

This fits nicely with the theory that we could all be in a coma right now.
Without the voice or intuition guiding us, we would be aware and unaware at the same time if Descartes is correct.

I apologize if this is a little hard to understand, but you are intelligent and educated on the subject, so I doubt you will have any trouble.

Edit:

Why stop at 2?

German Philosopher 'Kant' suggested that there are two types of worlds, Noumenal world, how things actually were independent of our perceptions of them [dreams] and the Phenomenal world, how we perceive the world around us.
However, Kant also stated that there was no way to travel between the two.
But, there was an American Philosopher called William James, he was also a psychologist and he moved Kant's theory up a level, stating that when we were in a dream state it was reality because that's where our thoughts were.
This is an extension of the theory that nothing exists until you perceive it. His reasoning was that if you cannot perceive anything real while you are dreaming, then where are you?
You can't be nowhere, otherwise you would die, so he stated that a dream was the bodies way of providing somewhere to exist for the duration of time you are asleep.
What if, the first time you fall asleep, the body is unable to begin perceiving the phenomenal world again so you are stuck in the false reality that your mind has created for you.

Kant also suggested that if one were able to travel between the two worlds, that person would be gifted or given prophetic visions because the Phenomenal world would run parallel to, but not equal with the Noumenal world.
Perhaps Nostradamus and other prophets had the ability to switch back and forth between these worlds?

Great post, but there are a couple more you could mention, Theo.

Take for instance Avicenna. He believed that during sleep all souls would travel to a 'Supernal' world, as he called it. In this place, the soul would be separated from the body and harbored with all of the other souls, in order to prevent demonic possession.

How could you forget Al Ghazali?
He was the first to ever connect dreams with the possibility of higher reality or dimensions activated by entering or deactivated by exiting a dream state, as they demonstrate both the fallibility of reliance on sense perception.

Philosophy wrote

Wez wrote Morgsboi, you may be interested to know, assuming you don't already, the views of Socrates and Descartes on the subject of Dreams.

This goes off topic slightly from your original question, but considering my last post on this topic already went off on a tangent, I don't see any harm in doing it again.

Socrates believed in something called a 'Daemonion', which was essentially a divine inner voice which could only be accessed or heard within the dream state.
Thomas Aquinas later backed this up, but instead of simply a divine inner voice, he stated that it was the voice of God, but that we should not listen to it, as it may be the voice of a demon, attempting to trick you into sin.
Moving back to Socrates and i'm going to claw at scraps right now trying to fit this with the topic, perhaps the voice, which has, after centuries of scrutiny been reverted back down to human intuition is the only thing that stops the dream state from becoming our reality?

Moving swiftly onto Rene Descartes, author of the famous philosophical phrase, 'I think therefore I am', disagreed with Socrates and instead stated that empirically, it is impossible to differentiate between the dream state and reality.

This fits nicely with the theory that we could all be in a coma right now.
Without the voice or intuition guiding us, we would be aware and unaware at the same time if Descartes is correct.

I apologize if this is a little hard to understand, but you are intelligent and educated on the subject, so I doubt you will have any trouble.

Edit:

Why stop at 2?

German Philosopher 'Kant' suggested that there are two types of worlds, Noumenal world, how things actually were independent of our perceptions of them [dreams] and the Phenomenal world, how we perceive the world around us.
However, Kant also stated that there was no way to travel between the two.
But, there was an American Philosopher called William James, he was also a psychologist and he moved Kant's theory up a level, stating that when we were in a dream state it was reality because that's where our thoughts were.
This is an extension of the theory that nothing exists until you perceive it. His reasoning was that if you cannot perceive anything real while you are dreaming, then where are you?
You can't be nowhere, otherwise you would die, so he stated that a dream was the bodies way of providing somewhere to exist for the duration of time you are asleep.
What if, the first time you fall asleep, the body is unable to begin perceiving the phenomenal world again so you are stuck in the false reality that your mind has created for you.

Kant also suggested that if one were able to travel between the two worlds, that person would be gifted or given prophetic visions because the Phenomenal world would run parallel to, but not equal with the Noumenal world.
Perhaps Nostradamus and other prophets had the ability to switch back and forth between these worlds?

Great post, but there are a couple more you could mention, Theo.

Take for instance Avicenna. He believed that during sleep all souls would travel to a 'Supernal' world, as he called it. In this place, the soul would be separated from the body and harbored with all of the other souls, in order to prevent demonic possession.

How could you forget Al Ghazali?
He was the first to ever connect dreams with the possibility of higher reality or dimensions activated by entering or deactivated by exiting a dream state, as they demonstrate both the fallibility of reliance on sense perception.

I was considering adding Al-Ghazali, but his theory doesn't seem to fit with this topic.

I agree though, Al-Ghazali was very much a pioneer in the higher reality/dimension field.
You should post your opinion on the whole topic, much more qualified than most to speak on the subject and not just because of your name...