Treyarch Dev Talks CoD Gun Balance and Why It’s Broken

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David Vonderhaar, Lead Gameplay Designer at Treyarch, has recently been talking with fans about a rather touchy subject: gun balance. He also had some very bold things to say regarding the direction Call of Duty seems to be going. He recently asked this question on Twitter: “True or False. Perks/ Proficiencies (like Steady Aim/ Quickdraw/ Kick) interfere with gun balance; get in the way of making game competitive.”

Apparently, Vonderhaar “feels like we could see greater gun diversity & less ‘OP’ weapons, if [he] could reserve those ‘properties’ to be part of the base gun.” He believes that “of course you have OP weapons if you can take any of the guns and make them fire faster, reload faster, be more accurate, and have less kick.” We can assume that an example of this could be the case of recoil-less weapons made even sturdier by proficiencies like kick. Instead, he suggests that “if every gun had the 1 or 2 things it did well and the 1 or 2 things it did poorly, you’d have better gun balance.” One fan asked if he considered the fact that perks and proficiencies might bring diversity to the game, which could level the playing field. Vonderhaar responded, “the guns don’t need Perks to be diverse. They can be diverse. Perks ensure they all have to be similar, so that the Perks don’t OP any one of the properties of the gun.”


Now, considering that proficiencies were introduced by Infinity Ward in Modern Warfare 3, could this be a critique of IW’s way of doing things? Or, perhaps even a critique of the direction Call of Duty has been going in general? It seems to be the case as Vonderhaar later boldly stated, “it’s the wrong way to think about it that’s comes from years of us abusing and conditioning you, perhaps, with crap gun tuning.” This also suggests that Treyarch’s next entry could be something a little different than what we’ve come to expect of the Call of Duty franchise.


Vonderhaar’s (much appreciative) transparency with Call of Duty fans is undoubtedly in preparation for Treyarch’s next title, be it “Iron Wolf” or “Black Ops 2.”


Let us know your thoughts in the comments section below. Do you feel perks and proficiencies can potentially ruin gun balance?

Posted:

Source: http://mp1st.com/2012/01/05/treyarch-dev-talks-cod-gun-balance-and-why-its-broken/

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TreyarchedPosted:

DerpyHoooves They're already working on another CoD?
Wow... This should be fun..


They must have started work on the new one as soon as they finished black ops.
IW an 3arc get turns for a yearly release so 2 years to make a game and support their current one isnt really that long.

triksta2k11Posted:

triksta2k11
Epic-BigC
DeadlyDasher
TTg_cntbanusall Five reasons Treyarch is supirior to IW:
1. This is HUGE & should almost count for two, ZOMBIES! People are buyin the game just for zombies!! I know I did!

2. NO quick scoping!! Snipers take skill, and are used more like a sniper should be used... As long range support.

3. Originality. Yes IW started the series, yes treyarch uses the same ingen but they have added things players love! Zombies, wager match, and COD points. They try and change enough that its NOT the same game.

4. Balance! Getting killed with a famas close range? Dont worry I'll use my rapid fire, or I'll use the ak47 and stay out of his range. Getting killed buy that ak47 in the window? It's okay I'll use my Galil! Perk balance: ghost, SOH, ninja = lightweight, steady aim, marathon = Scavenger, warlord, hacker.... Etc

5. Killstreaks, killstreaks, killstreaks. The kill streaks in black ops aside from the RC-XD, Hiende(spelling? Idk) where almost perfect! Even the RC was very useful if used correctly. Attack heli, chopper gunner, dogs. Those used as a combo where epic. Or napalm, turret, b-52 bomber. Or spy plane, attack heli, blackbird. They were just so good & used with a good team as separate combo's could win the game easy with 75+ kills a game!

That's MY opinion... And you are entitled to yours, please share what you think.


1. Zombies is the only thing Treyarch is good for their multiplayz suckzkzkzk big ****.

2. QUICKSCOPING IS HOW URZ SUPOS TO SNIPE, IF U HARDSCOP UR A NOOB, SNPRS ARE MAD FOR QUICK SCOPN.

3. COD POINTZ IZ STUPD CUZ MULTIPLAYR FAILS

4. BALANCE? DATS GAY, BALANCED GAMES ARE BORINGG THTS Y GAYARCH FAILZ AND IW PWNS THEM.

5. AMG I CNT GET A KLL WIT MY NAPALM N AVE IT CNT TOW4RDS MY K1LLSTREAK GAYARCH IS STEWPID.

MY ONIPION IZ FCT. IF YOU LIEK BLACK OPZ AND GAYARCH U LIEKZ TO TAKE IT UP THE BUTT TEWW!!

- Response from an 12- 15 year old average IW fan boy
Sounds more like a retarded child who can't learn that you type with your hands/fingers. not you f-ing forehead. BTW Treyach's stupid Black Ops is still better than MW3 fails. I am still playing Black ops because at least the game is decent rather than playing the wasted sixty dollars on MW3, which is a total disaster in my opinion.

Very well said. MW3 is plain and simply, a fail. Black Ops was also a fail but is still far better than MW3. Oh and to that kid who's writing in capitals, you're a failed abortion. You're an idiotic necrophiliac who has A.D.H.D and dislexia. Don't reply to another comment until you have them things sorted, ok?

Haha forget that last part of what I said. I didn't realise what you were talking about. Sorry bro!

triksta2k11Posted:

Epic-BigC
DeadlyDasher
TTg_cntbanusall Five reasons Treyarch is supirior to IW:
1. This is HUGE & should almost count for two, ZOMBIES! People are buyin the game just for zombies!! I know I did!

2. NO quick scoping!! Snipers take skill, and are used more like a sniper should be used... As long range support.

3. Originality. Yes IW started the series, yes treyarch uses the same ingen but they have added things players love! Zombies, wager match, and COD points. They try and change enough that its NOT the same game.

4. Balance! Getting killed with a famas close range? Dont worry I'll use my rapid fire, or I'll use the ak47 and stay out of his range. Getting killed buy that ak47 in the window? It's okay I'll use my Galil! Perk balance: ghost, SOH, ninja = lightweight, steady aim, marathon = Scavenger, warlord, hacker.... Etc

5. Killstreaks, killstreaks, killstreaks. The kill streaks in black ops aside from the RC-XD, Hiende(spelling? Idk) where almost perfect! Even the RC was very useful if used correctly. Attack heli, chopper gunner, dogs. Those used as a combo where epic. Or napalm, turret, b-52 bomber. Or spy plane, attack heli, blackbird. They were just so good & used with a good team as separate combo's could win the game easy with 75+ kills a game!

That's MY opinion... And you are entitled to yours, please share what you think.


1. Zombies is the only thing Treyarch is good for their multiplayz suckzkzkzk big ****.

2. QUICKSCOPING IS HOW URZ SUPOS TO SNIPE, IF U HARDSCOP UR A NOOB, SNPRS ARE MAD FOR QUICK SCOPN.

3. COD POINTZ IZ STUPD CUZ MULTIPLAYR FAILS

4. BALANCE? DATS GAY, BALANCED GAMES ARE BORINGG THTS Y GAYARCH FAILZ AND IW PWNS THEM.

5. AMG I CNT GET A KLL WIT MY NAPALM N AVE IT CNT TOW4RDS MY K1LLSTREAK GAYARCH IS STEWPID.

MY ONIPION IZ FCT. IF YOU LIEK BLACK OPZ AND GAYARCH U LIEKZ TO TAKE IT UP THE BUTT TEWW!!

- Response from an 12- 15 year old average IW fan boy
Sounds more like a retarded child who can't learn that you type with your hands/fingers. not you f-ing forehead. BTW Treyach's stupid Black Ops is still better than MW3 fails. I am still playing Black ops because at least the game is decent rather than playing the wasted sixty dollars on MW3, which is a total disaster in my opinion.

Very well said. MW3 is plain and simply, a fail. Black Ops was also a fail but is still far better than MW3. Oh and to that kid who's writing in capitals, you're a failed abortion. You're an idiotic necrophiliac who has A.D.H.D and dislexia. Don't reply to another comment until you have them things sorted, ok?

WhisperPosted:

I want a different game. I mean come on, there is many game studios creating games, but no game can keep me interested. They need to put more time into their games. They work for 2 years on their own call of duty game, and it usually turns out like crap. MW3 was the same as MW2, but had a few things that made me not play it anymore. IW does NOT listen to the community. That is a big downfall to their company, they are all lazy and when they earn their money they are done. Treyarch are not the best game makers either, but they take care of their games. If only Treyarch and IW could work together on the next cod and pump out a cod every 2 years together, and not every year by alternating, I think that cod would be an enjoyable game. I think each company knows they will make bank and just don't put any effort into making there games. Look at MW3, it looks just like MW2. And the graphics of BO is terrible. If only they could work together, then I think this franchise will succeed in making the fans happy.

SgTDoPeY13Posted:

sackorice
Rozy I was a HUGE IW fan before black ops, but then treayarch showed they can make games.

1. Black Ops maps were the best ny call of duty multiplayer offered.

2. Guns were way more balanced

3. Modern Warfare 3, messed up because of sledgehammer.

4. IW and 3arc should combined to make a COD


Black ops had the worst multiplayer, no guns were balanced at all


just because the guns dont deal as much damage as MW2 or 3's do, doesnt mean they are unbalanced

ODSTPosted:

DeadlyDasher
TTg_cntbanusall Five reasons Treyarch is supirior to IW:
1. This is HUGE & should almost count for two, ZOMBIES! People are buyin the game just for zombies!! I know I did!

2. NO quick scoping!! Snipers take skill, and are used more like a sniper should be used... As long range support.

3. Originality. Yes IW started the series, yes treyarch uses the same ingen but they have added things players love! Zombies, wager match, and COD points. They try and change enough that its NOT the same game.

4. Balance! Getting killed with a famas close range? Dont worry I'll use my rapid fire, or I'll use the ak47 and stay out of his range. Getting killed buy that ak47 in the window? It's okay I'll use my Galil! Perk balance: ghost, SOH, ninja = lightweight, steady aim, marathon = Scavenger, warlord, hacker.... Etc

5. Killstreaks, killstreaks, killstreaks. The kill streaks in black ops aside from the RC-XD, Hiende(spelling? Idk) where almost perfect! Even the RC was very useful if used correctly. Attack heli, chopper gunner, dogs. Those used as a combo where epic. Or napalm, turret, b-52 bomber. Or spy plane, attack heli, blackbird. They were just so good & used with a good team as separate combo's could win the game easy with 75+ kills a game!

That's MY opinion... And you are entitled to yours, please share what you think.


1. Zombies is the only thing Treyarch is good for their multiplayz suckzkzkzk big ****.

2. QUICKSCOPING IS HOW URZ SUPOS TO SNIPE, IF U HARDSCOP UR A NOOB, SNPRS ARE MAD FOR QUICK SCOPN.

3. COD POINTZ IZ STUPD CUZ MULTIPLAYR FAILS

4. BALANCE? DATS GAY, BALANCED GAMES ARE BORINGG THTS Y GAYARCH FAILZ AND IW PWNS THEM.

5. AMG I CNT GET A KLL WIT MY NAPALM N AVE IT CNT TOW4RDS MY K1LLSTREAK GAYARCH IS STEWPID.

MY ONIPION IZ FCT. IF YOU LIEK BLACK OPZ AND GAYARCH U LIEKZ TO TAKE IT UP THE BUTT TEWW!!

- Response from an 12- 15 year old average IW fan boy
Sounds more like a retarded child who can't learn that you type with your hands/fingers. not you f-ing forehead. BTW Treyach's stupid Black Ops is still better than MW3 fails. I am still playing Black ops because at least the game is decent rather than playing the wasted sixty dollars on MW3, which is a total disaster in my opinion.

MubbPosted:

They're already working on another CoD?
Wow... This should be fun..

DistrezDZNPosted:

wtf there is no need to make another cod that quick, wen they rush stuff like that u get crapy games like mw3 if they make another cod they should take there time to make it that way the graphics dont look like shit and fix a shit load of glitches before they release it to the public

DeadlyDasherPosted:

TTg_cntbanusall Five reasons Treyarch is supirior to IW:
1. This is HUGE & should almost count for two, ZOMBIES! People are buyin the game just for zombies!! I know I did!

2. NO quick scoping!! Snipers take skill, and are used more like a sniper should be used... As long range support.

3. Originality. Yes IW started the series, yes treyarch uses the same ingen but they have added things players love! Zombies, wager match, and COD points. They try and change enough that its NOT the same game.

4. Balance! Getting killed with a famas close range? Dont worry I'll use my rapid fire, or I'll use the ak47 and stay out of his range. Getting killed buy that ak47 in the window? It's okay I'll use my Galil! Perk balance: ghost, SOH, ninja = lightweight, steady aim, marathon = Scavenger, warlord, hacker.... Etc

5. Killstreaks, killstreaks, killstreaks. The kill streaks in black ops aside from the RC-XD, Hiende(spelling? Idk) where almost perfect! Even the RC was very useful if used correctly. Attack heli, chopper gunner, dogs. Those used as a combo where epic. Or napalm, turret, b-52 bomber. Or spy plane, attack heli, blackbird. They were just so good & used with a good team as separate combo's could win the game easy with 75+ kills a game!

That's MY opinion... And you are entitled to yours, please share what you think.


1. Zombies is the only thing Treyarch is good for their multiplayz suckzkzkzk big dick.

2. QUICKSCOPING IS HOW URZ SUPOS TO SNIPE, IF U HARDSCOP UR A NOOB, SNPRS ARE MAD FOR QUICK SCOPN.

3. COD POINTZ IZ STUPD CUZ MULTIPLAYR FAILS

4. BALANCE? DATS GAY, BALANCED GAMES ARE BORINGG THTS Y GAYARCH FAILZ AND IW PWNS THEM.

5. AMG I CNT GET A KLL WIT MY NAPALM N AVE IT CNT TOW4RDS MY K1LLSTREAK GAYARCH IS STEWPID.

MY ONIPION IZ FCT. IF YOU LIEK BLACK OPZ AND GAYARCH U LIEKZ TO TAKE IT UP THE BUTT TEWW!!

- Response from an 12- 15 year old average IW fan boy

aBoxOfMintsPosted:

TTg_cntbanusall
sackorice
Rozy I was a HUGE IW fan before black ops, but then treayarch showed they can make games.

1. Black Ops maps were the best ny call of duty multiplayer offered.

2. Guns were way more balanced

3. Modern Warfare 3, messed up because of sledgehammer

4. IW and 3arc should combined to make a COD


Black ops had the worst multiplayer, no guns were balanced at all
are you bind? Do you know what balance means? It means that any gun can be out gunned, depending on player skill & type of player. Everyone complained about the famas because they would rush and get killed in the same spot everytime! If you stay back and use anyother AR you can out range him. And rapid fire is nothing compared to a spaz at close range. Balance: when two things weigh the same, or in this case, each gun has a flaw that another gun can beat it, just depends on player and know how.

I disagree IW should never involve themselves in what Treyarch is doing.. That way no one can blame the game sucking on the other dev, there games are so much different and I like to see the defferencs when I play! Next COD I do not wan't to see a black ops/MW3 mix that would be the exact same game over again!! :(


I agree man, Balance is something that Battlefield 3 has achieved and that COD Dev's need to focus on how they can achieve such things!


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